BBC4 Twitchers programme

Roger Baker 3 · Status: Offline

BBC4 Twitchers programme

Suzanne Tattersall · Status: Offline

I think when he reaches 500 his wife will leave him !

JOHN TYMON wrote:

JOHN TYMON wrote:

Watched it on bbci last week,and it was the most cringeworthy programme I have ever watched,it made every birder look like complete idiots,and if firing round the country like that has anything to do with birding is beyond me,Even the ones supposedly at the top of the list were just dependant on the bird being identified for them,for me the whole programme seemed a complete waste of time.

and why would the so called towards the top of the list travel to ireland for 2 days ,then sit in a bar whining and not helping anyone,more time and money than sence for me,id rather throw my bins and camera int bin than be like that.and I just happened to be at Hollingworth taking Landscapes the other day when i was in the hide almost on my own when the pied billed grebe went past at 10 feet

JOHN TYMON · Status: Offline

JOHN TYMON wrote:

Watched it on bbci last week,and it was the most cringeworthy programme I have ever watched,it made every birder look like complete idiots,and if firing round the country like that has anything to do with birding is beyond me,Even the ones supposedly at the top of the list were just dependant on the bird being identified for them,for me the whole programme seemed a complete waste of time.

and why would the so called towards the top of the list travel to ireland for 2 days ,then sit in a bar whining and not helping anyone,more time and money than sence for me,id rather throw my bins and camera int bin than be like that.

and I just happened to be at Hollingworth taking Landscapes

the other day when i was in the hide almost on my own when the pied billed grebe went past at 10 feet

JOHN TYMON · Status: Offline

Watched it on bbci last week,and it was the most cringeworthy programme I have ever watched,it made every birder look like complete idiots,and if firing round the country like that has anything to do with birding is beyond me,Even the ones supposedly at the top of the list were just dependant on the bird being identified for them,for me the whole programme seemed a complete waste of time.

Neil McCall · Status: Offline

Fascinating program - one of those guys featured compared twitching to trainspotting and I must admit in my youth I enjoyed trainspotting, which was relatively easy as a hobby - all the locos had nice big numbers on the side, they didn't migrate and you didn't need to worry about going to the Scillies or Fair Isle. I tried to see every UK loco, got down to "needing" about 100 and gave it up when one of my "blockers" was transferred from Sheffield to Inverness and I didn't have the money or inclination to twitch it only to possibly find it had pottered up to Thurso or was in the works.

I flirted with twitching birds for a while, what gave me pause for thought was taking a day from work out to twitch a Hoopoe in some park near Stoke on a vile day one December - I actually got the Hoopoe but was lucky to do so, saw a grand day list of about five and wondered what kind of day was had by the folk who missed it. At Martin Mere I might not have got a lifer but I'd have been reasonably warm and dry, seen lots of geese, swans and maybe a good raptor or two and could eat a hot pie in comfort.

Mike Chorley · Status: Offline

Matt Potter wrote:

If Riggers, Chorley and myself were filmed on a Norfolk trip several years ago, it could be edited to show us as drunken, jokey, incompetant birders, when the truth couldnt be further away....

Whatever do you mean Mr. Potter? Could you possibly be refering to my back seat driving?

Matt Potter · Status: Offline

Rob Smallwood wrote:

There is an interview with Lee Evans on YouTube or via BirdGuides which may be of interest.

A pretty intresting interview and despite what you think of Lee Evans, he certainly has a passion for birds which came accross well.

It would be very intresting to see all the filmed footage. I agree with him that careful editing can change the perspective of an individual.

If Riggers, Chorley and myself were filmed on a Norfolk trip several years ago, it could be edited to show us as drunken, jokey, incompetant birders, when the truth couldnt be further away....

What ever you think of the guy, and I have seen him a few times at a twitch or two, he doesnt always deserve the bad press that he gets.

On the programme, i enjoyed it although it was well edited to show the non birders what 'we are all like' which is obviously tarring us with that same brush.

I used to twitch a lot and still do now and agian as I need to, to see new birds which I think is prefectly fine. We all twitch to some extent, whether its a new bird for you GM list, a rare bird locally, or the dash up the motorway to see that mega!

As long as we still enjoy our passion and hobby, thats the most important thing!!

Paul Heaton · Status: Offline

Sorry Steve, I am sure it will stay around for the weekend.

Rob had a good laugh at all the lee evens clips on you tube

Then I found the one I wanted, its on the DAVID LINDO interviews Lee Evans part 1,2.

Having been on TV in the animal hospital series, the editing of programmes can make you look a complete fool, and the issue of making a sensation out of all hobbies is a shame, but that the modern way, I do like the following which explains birding,

For those that practise it bird-watching is not only a sport and a science, but something near a religion, and after all its externals have been inventoried the essence stays incommunicable.

The Art of Birdwatching, Max Nicholson (1931).

Keep birding in all its forms

Rob Smallwood · Status: Offline

There is an interview with Lee Evans on YouTube or via BirdGuides which may be of interest.

Steve Suttill · Status: Offline

Paul Heaton wrote:

No matter what we thought of the antics of the birders in this programme, are we all not a little bit GUILTY now as a result of Pied billed Grebe

Keep Birding

Not all of us, Paul! Some of us can't get off work

County Report to print in order to bring further happiness to those who could go and see the Grebe

BTO meeting in Wales on Saturday. Let's hope it stays 'til Sunday.

Steve

Paul Heaton · Status: Offline

A very honest reply Mike, and yes the birding Gods have shone on GM, and I do believe this bird as with other twitches can show birders in a better light.

To show no-birders/ locals a rare bird is always the correct thing to do, and to enjoy our hobby for whatever reasons, is the joy of birding.

Glad you caught up with it and enjoyed it.

Keep birding.

ps A Bird in the Bush a social history of birdwatching by Stephen Moss is an excellent read on these dark nights.

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

Hi Paul,

Concerning the Pied - billed Grebe and the ensuing twitch.

If we're GUILTY of anything, surely it's enjoying an overdue "gift from the birding gods" and appreciating this bird, not in a selfish competitive way, but in sharing the fun with others, and also with curious non birders invited to look through our 'scopes, etc. and to share the experience, building bridges with the public at large; - after all, let's be honest, it doesn't happen often enough in Gr. Manchester. (I think the last national rarity (if it still is one) may have been Pennington's Glossy Ibis).
I was on site watching the bird within 2 1/2 hours of the news breaking, (120+ miles), so if any GUILT is involved, I'm as guilty as anybody, - but chuffed as a butty, as they say!
I went off early simply to try to nail the Scaup at Elton before dusk (yes, that's another I need for Gr. Man.!)
However I returned yesterday to enjoy the Grebe again with an Elton birder ( the local patcher who found the Bittern there) who hadn't even heard of it.

- All in all great occasion; - met a few more Manky birders and some other familiar faces; (all looking older!)
Cheers,
Mike P.

Paul Heaton · Status: Offline

No matter what we thought of the antics of the birders in this programme, are we all not a little bit GUILTY now as a result of Pied billed Grebe

Keep Birding

mike killelea · Status: Offline

Mike Passant wrote:

This arose from the amount of exposure given to "you know who" and his easily led fringe group of acolytes whose prime ambition in life seems to revolve rather too unhealthily around their ranking in the arguably ludicrous "UK 400 club." One of them actually said on camera: - "Lee can destroy you..." - Well really? - Surely only if you believe in voodoo.

Hi Mike
Your post has given me a great idea

I have just started the 600 club please send all aplications allong with a 20 pound note to

Regards

Mike

-- Edited by mike killelea on Thursday 4th of November 2010 11:30:33 AM

Pete Astles · Status: Offline

Just watched the programme, taped it earlier in the week. I have to say I really enjoyed it. I agree with the comments on here re how it portrays birders etc. I could never do what these guys do going from Scilly Isles to Scotland it would have to be a pterodactyl to get me to do something like that and even then I would have to think about it. But you have to admire the pure obsession of these people. And if we are honest dont we all twitch to some extent for example if we see a rare bird on say penny on this site and we decide to have a look is that not twitching to some extent?

Simon Warford · Status: Offline

Neil, my dad posted further down the thread, the bird at Inishboffin was indeed a Cedar Waxwing. The swallow was a fly through and only seen by 2 birders.

Although I did enjoy the programme I did find it rather cringeworthy at times to say the least. If thats what top end twitching is like I think I will stick to my new passion of visible migration! 8 Whoopers heading south over the moor is exciting right?

Having done my fair share of twitching in my 20's I have always been and always will be a dedicated patchworker. Nothing compares to the excitement of finding your own rarity whether its on a national level or local level. Ive been lucky enough to find many good birds, the highest point of my "career" finding a Caspian Tern in Derbyshire while at University. Surely Garry Bagnall is out looking for his own birds when not twitching? He said because the pager was quiet he was having a day at home!

He came accross as someone who is purely interested in seeing other peoples finds, no wonder the irish birders completely blanked him!

LGRE is correct though cheating is rife in the birding world, thats a fact but people are only cheating themselves. I have witnessed it with my own eyes.

The program seemed to be filmed in a way that portrayed all of them in a bad light one way or the other, which was done so that it would cause debate and conflict in the birding world and it seems that this has certainly been the case.

One thing is for certain twitchers are anything but sane

.

Keep working the patch

-- Edited by Simon Warford on Wednesday 3rd of November 2010 09:49:45 PM

Mark Rigby · Status: Offline

Or does George Michael see himself as the Ian McKerchar of the pop world

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Nick Isherwood wrote:

Couldn't help but laugh when Lee Evans compaired himself to George Michael...

I wonder if Mr McKerchar sees himself as the George Michael of Manchester Birding?

Andy Bissitt · Status: Offline

I must say that I'm heartened by the tone of the messages on this board. Whilst watching the prog I began to think that if I voiced what was going through my head, I might never be able to turn up at a local 'mega' again. However, you have all said exactly what I was going to in the main.

I would just add that like alcoholism, gambling, drug addiction etc... if you let something get a hold on you to the extent it had with the featured guys and girls, you become an inconsiderate, selfish, obsessed individual who will surely wreck innocent lives all around you.

Thank God we're all sane, yes??

Neil Calbrade · Status: Offline

To be fair, the programme was titled "Twitchers: A very British Obsession", so us proper birders who actually find everything and do the leg work for the twitchers to turn up, watch it for a few seconds and leave didn't get a mention. Unfortunately, any birder these days is automatically branded a twitcher by the public or media, which does mean we get lumped with some of the idiots which give the majority a bad name.

Think the bird in Ireland, was Northern Rough-winged Swallow, they mentioned on the programme that it was seem coming in off the sea and flying around for a bit. The Cedar Waxwing was about the same time but I assume he would have got the Notts bird, unless it turned up during his plane spotting phase?!

I obviously weasn't listening in class when I did A-level geography, I was always led to believe that Ireland wasn't in Britain. Why not just include birds seen in America on your British list if basic geography doesn't count? What about Gibraltar or Falklands? At least we own those!!

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Henry Cook wrote:

That's where the rush is, stumbling on your own rarity!

I'll second that!
I always find twitching a bit of an anticlimax, even if you see the bird!
It's the not knowing what you're going to see that makes birding exciting!

-- Edited by Rob Thorpe on Wednesday 3rd of November 2010 05:18:28 PM

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

I watched the program belatedly on computer last night, but with mixed feelings. It was great to see the scene at Trow Quarry up here on the coast when the Eastern Crowned W. turned up, and the scene up at the Sandhill Crane twitch, (happy days!) but as regards other aspects, I must admit to a certain embarrassment.

This arose from the amount of exposure given to "you know who" and his easily led fringe group of acolytes whose prime ambition in life seems to revolve rather too unhealthily around their ranking in the arguably ludicrous "UK 400 club." One of them actually said on camera: - "Lee can destroy you..." - Well really? - Surely only if you believe in voodoo.

The same guy happily shot off to Southern Ireland on a wing and a prayer to dip on whatever species, ( I don't think we were told) at seemingly ludicrous expense aiming to add a species to his (British??- surely not; - surely European) list.

Each to his own, of course as regards what you want to consider a species, (there are now so many differing treatments that the field guides can't keep up with them) and what "delusional geography" you adhere to; but I was just embarrassed at the lack of balance in the programme, with the focus too much on the lunatic fringe, with only one twitcher shown as very guardedly voicing reservations about you know who.
I dearly love birding and truly enjoy the odd twitch, (either alone or in good company), but fail to see what this programme did for birding in general, other than to sadly and disproportionately portray us as a bunch of obsessive "nutters" who need to get a life; - perhaps that was the aim?

Henry Cook · Status: Offline

Geoff Hargreaves wrote:

I did find it a little strange that the birders in the programme made no mention or offered no thanks to the actual finders of the birds they so desire.

The twitchers in the prog are all so transfixed on getting their lists bigger Geoff that they forget why they have the opportunity to add new species in the first place; the result of combined effort and experience of birders who find the stuff in the first place. That's where the rush is, stumbling on your own rarity!

Geoff Hargreaves · Status: Offline

Just finished watching this strange 'birding' programme,and as fan of the GM200 club I do twitch within the county so I have some understanding of 'the rush' and the 'dip'.I did find it a little strange that the birders in the programme made no mention or offered no thanks to the actual finders of the birds they so desire.

cheers geoff,arrogant,conceited,insane,but thats just me

Alan Warford · Status: Offline

Cedar Waxwing in Nottingham was 1996, therfore he's reached 500 in less than 14 years I guess. Must have cost a fortune, BTW Saw it myself.

Craig Higson · Status: Offline

Alan Warford wrote:

We are fairly sure the bird in Ireland was Cedar Waxwing.

Cheers Alan. I presume Gary hadnt been twitching that long then because I'm sure there was one of those in Nottingham in the late 1990's wasnt there?
I'm guessing he's spent quite a bit getting to just short of 500 species in under 10years then!

-- Edited by Craig Higson on Tuesday 2nd of November 2010 10:10:37 PM

Alan Warford · Status: Offline

We are fairly sure the bird in Ireland was Cedar Waxwing.

Craig Higson · Status: Offline

Oh yeah - what was the bird they were twitching in Ireland? They didnt actually name the bird did they?

Henry Cook · Status: Offline

I felt sorry for the young girl but also the wives of the twitchers featured. Brett Richards at one point exclaimed he'd rather die than stop twitching, what must his missus have thought?!

Thought i'd cringe throughout, but only cringed a handful of times!
Nice to see some footage of the rarities involved.

It's still on iplayer for anyone who missed it.
Thanks. Henry.

Craig Higson · Status: Offline

I really enjoyed it. I cant get my head around the need to do it to the extremes shown on this programme, but each to their own. Reminded me of one birder who travelled from the Scillies to Spurn one October, on arrival at Spurn his pager went of for a Siberian Rubythroat in Dorset or Cornwall, so he travelled back to where he had just come from, slept in the car, dipped, drove back to Yorkshire to start a night turn. Bonkers.

Was it just me that felt a tad sorry for the young girl? Its great when kids are into birds/wildlife etc but as a parent I felt she was playing second fiddle to her parents hobby when it should really be the other way around (well it is in my world).

One big question though - why is it that people seem frightened of Lee Evans? Presumably its because he runs the Uk 400 club and to have a bird accepted onto your list he wants to verify it? (Should I be worried that when my list gets to 400 (well maybe not) Mr Evans will be scrutinising it and asking for details?) If thats the case, why dont they/someone else start a different club?

Personally I find that whole side of it stranger than the driving overnight to see a Sandhill Crane, which is undeniably a cracking bird.

-- Edited by Craig Higson on Tuesday 2nd of November 2010 05:12:43 PM

John Rayner · Status: Offline

The 7 year old was the undoubted star of last night's show. Superb line when she was sat in the back of a car thumbing the Collins Guide and the researcher asked her, "Is that your favourite book?"

A long, searching look before the weary reply, "No! OUR favourite book". Classic!

Cheers, John

Nick Isherwood · Status: Offline

Great programme and a really good insight into the extreme side of birding. Couldn't help but laugh when Lee Evans compaired himself to George Michael and also the bit where he said he became 'exhumed' by twitching - classic!!

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

I actually thought it was a good insight into "real" twitching and as Paul quite rightly says, we all twitch at one level or another so it's really up to the individual how far they want to take it.

I personally do enjoy both local patch birding and also going twitching.

Recognised one or two faces on there as well, it will be interesting to see what they have to say.

Paul Heaton · Status: Offline

Fan-bloody-tastic

I forgot how mad it all was.

The 400 club was the Holy Grail when I was young, then they moved the goal-post to 450, 500 was a dream of the Elite. Mad Bad and Dangerous to know! twitching can damage your health, and marriage. But it was GOOD?

From a very early twitch by push bike for my first Smew to Harlequin ducks in Scotland, Pacific Swift, Little Bustard, Slender- billed gull, Bobolink. Black and White Warbler, American Thrushes to birds I never heard of Long Billed Murrelet.

I had a blast, slept in the back of the van, Bird hides, the back of a pub car-park waiting for it to come light, for a Northern-water thrush

Happy days, it was great to see some old faces and dear friends last night, brought back loads of great memories, Yes its mad stupid and pointless, but I loved it.

Have grown up a bit now ( not Really ) just cannot afford it anymore.

Nothing wrong with twitching we all do it at one level or another , but always remember birding is for you, its your joy in life, take it to what ever level you want, enjoy it while you can, and always

Keep Birding.

Bill Myerscough · Status: Offline

One of the lessons to be learnt from this programme? However desperate, never ever accept a lift in a car driven by a twitcher!

Driving for hours at a time that would put an unlicensed Eastern European lorry driver to shame. Driving for hours without taking food or drink and indeed probably also prescription medicines that they need to keep them alive or sane or both!

Driving at speeds where the national speed limit is but a distant memory. Driving whilst talking on a mobile phone. And should you be fortunate enough to reach your destination in one piece, then you can look forward to the car being parked either illegally or inconsiderately! Plus it might be a handy skill to able to get out of a car whilst it is still moving........as the driver will probably be doing the same before he or she sprints across a muddy field, in the back of beyond, looking for some wind-blow stray that will probably be dead in 24 hours.....if it lives that long with all the twitchers on top of it!

Statistically you might be less likely to have an accident and even feel safer in a car driven by George Michael!

Keep (your wits about you whilst) birding!

Bill.

-- Edited by Bill Myerscough on Tuesday 2nd of November 2010 07:11:29 AM

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Reminded me exactly why I don't twitch: Twitchers!

Also, the program did little if anything to distance Twitchers from Birders, which means that unfortunatley us Birders will continue to be associated with these oddballs (oddball being an understatement with regards to Mr Evans...

)

-- Edited by Rob Thorpe on Monday 1st of November 2010 10:13:53 PM

sid ashton · Status: Offline

As stated on the Birds on Television Thread this programme will now be on BBC 4 Monday 1st November at 9pm

Craig Higson · Status: Offline

sid ashton wrote:

Full details:-

Twitchers A Very British Obsession on BBC 4, Wednesday 3rd November at 9pm.

Ah. Thought I was losing my mind when I couldnt find it on the planner.

sid ashton · Status: Offline

Full details:-

Twitchers A Very British Obsession on BBC 4, Wednesday 3rd November at 9pm.

Mike Crawley · Status: Offline

thanks Judith. Hopefully, see you on St Mary's in the next couple of weeks.

BTW the twitchers programme has been re-scheduled for November.

Judith Smith · Status: Offline

Five other birding programmes on BBC 4 shortly will be featuring Rob Lambert, ex-Bolton birder, familiar to regular Scilly visitors each autumn. Rob now lectures at Nottingham University in Environmental History:

5th October 9pm When Britain went wild
1st, 8th, 15th and 22nd November - 9pm Birds Britannica

Mike Crawley · Status: Offline

ah but, probably be lots of people shown but very few birds

Mark Rigby · Status: Offline

Mike Crawley wrote:

I've just read that the "Twitchers-A very British Obsession" will be televised on 6th October on BBC4, starting at 9pm and finishing at 10pm.

Might or might not be to your taste in televisual treats but I thought I'd post here just in case anyone would like to watch.

Mike

Or you could have posted it on the thread below, "Birds on Television"

Mike Crawley · Status: Offline

I've just read that the "Twitchers-A very British Obsession" will be televised on 6th October on BBC4, starting at 9pm and finishing at 10pm.

Might or might not be to your taste in televisual treats but I thought I'd post here just in case anyone would like to watch.

Mike