BOROUGH LISTING

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

RE: BOROUGH LISTING

Richard Thew · Status: Offline

Mike Passant wrote:

and I most likely will never hit my original target of 100 species per borough

Question: Wouldn't this be depending on what species would pass throuh? If say, you start with a good year and the following years beyond that for other birders later on the migration patterns are not as productive, would this not influence the outcome?

-- Edited by Richard Thew on Saturday 11th of July 2020 07:34:40 AM

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Good question Mike...
Maybe a friendly Borough Yearlist competition for 2021? Has it really been a whole decade since we did that??

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

What happened to the enthusiasm generated by all the borough listers of 10/11 years ago? I ask because this thread has been dormant for over 5 years now.

My own progress has been slowed due to advancing years and inevitable lack of motivation, and I most likely will never hit my original target of 100 species per borough (as an AVERAGE across the ten boroughs, - I am stuck on 92.6 presently) but there is at least one of the diehards down there who has achieved 100 species in every borough, which is of course an outstanding feat.

Stay safe all,

Mike P

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

I cannot type in Cyrillic on my computer, but in our alphabet the closest would be:

"Ya doljshen bolshyer vihodit."- If you can practise that a couple of dozen times and look a bit sneaky at the same time, you could likely pass for Putin, (or in your case, Tolstoy).

Now enough of this nonsense; - this is a birding site!

-- Edited by Mike Passant on Wednesday 25th of February 2015 07:07:11 PM

John Rayner · Status: Offline

Mike Passant wrote:

I already have access to comfortably appointed padded rooms in each of the ten boroughs involved;- (it's called FORWARD PLANNING). My preferred lodging house of these even has an extensive library of Russian language books, amongst which my favourite book is "501 Russian Verbs" (fully conjugated).

..... such a scheme would necessitate me having to make trans-dimensional travel arrangements and for such journeys the travel insurance premiums alone are prohibitive; (I know these things as I have sounded out both Sun Life and the AA.

___________________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Mike,

Sounds like you need a padded room up in Durham as well. What's "I must get out more" in Russian smile

? I hope we see you down in GM soon.

Cheers John

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

Dear esteemed Mr Heaton,

Firstly ;- Greetings from the icey north!

Secondly; - You are way behind the times!! I already have access to comfortably appointed padded rooms in each of the ten boroughs involved;- (it's called FORWARD PLANNING). My preferred lodging house of these even has an extensive library of Russian language books, amongst which my favourite book is "501 Russian Verbs" (fully conjugated).

I should respectfully point out that attaining an average of 100 species sightings per borough is nothing like as formidable a task as seeing 100 in each and every one of the said boroughs; such a scheme would necessitate me having to make trans-dimensional travel arrangements and for such journeys the travel insurance premiums alone are prohibitive; (I know these things as I have sounded out both Sun Life and the AA).

I'll see you at the next "big one"?

Regards,
Mikhail

Paul Heaton · Status: Offline

Mr Passant, I have to agree you are bonkers in trying to see 100 birds in each Borough in Greater Manchester, I cannot think why anyone would want to do such a insane crazy thing....

Plus I have lost a few notebook, and if I was .lets just say thinking about it .....I would say my bogey borough would be.... no no I am not even thinking about it.

keep birding.

ps, will open a special room with padded walls in the GM 200 club for you Mike

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

I haven't managed any birding in Greater Manchester in the two months since 22nd December (apart from one hour and thirty five minutes spent at Elton on 13th February). This was an opportunistic visit as we had attended the funeral of a dear friend in Hazel Grove on the previous day.
Adding to my borough listing effort is of course, (as to be expected), more difficult now as I have added in the last few years a further 342 records to attain an average across all ten boroughs of 88.9 species per borough, so my target of 100 average across all the boroughs no longer looks too daunting. Whether or not I can find the time and motivation to make further progress remains to be seen.

No doubt some of the highest ranked members of the 200 club would have "higher scores" were they simply to add up and collate their records over the last thirty or so years; - though I suspect I may be the only one bonkers enough to be doing this?

Carry on birding!!

Regards,
Mike P.

-- Edited by Mike Passant on Tuesday 24th of February 2015 09:16:03 AM

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

With early May now just some 5/6 weeks away I wonder if there is any appetite for some "big day" listing efforts again this year, or is everyone too knackered?

Quite apart from the considerable challenge of a Greater Manchester big day attempt (with all its logistical problems of threading one's way through traffic at various times of day to get from say the Wigan side over to Oldham, etc.) there remains of course the option of trying a borough big day in any or all of the ten Manchester boroughs;- how close to 100 in a day can you get in your chosen borough?
Surely 80 plus is possible in most boroughs and regardless of the result, the effort is a lot of fun, and who knows what might be found in the process?

The benchmark for this stands as the mark set by Rob and Terry Thorpe a few years ago who achieved 100 in a day in Wigan Borough by bicycle and on foot only; - an extremely tough target to better even with use of a car.

- Just a thought,

Regards,
Mike P.

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

My "birding time" in Greater Manchester is generally precious,and I'm often just in transit through the county en route to somewhere else, so it's seemingly always against the clock, which is why when I am down here, I'm normally out and about around 4.30 a.m. to maximise both the experience, the fun, and the opportunity.
(It really strikes me that time here elapses at a faster rate than in the rest of the universe, and have been trying to decide whether this would make you residents look older, or younger, than you actually are. - I think you should look older?)

However, I'm digressing a bit.

I've started a spread with all the species I've seen in each of the ten Manchester Borough's, and it does add an extra dimension to my birding visits. Even if I fail to add a Manchester lifer on any given visit, I can generally add to one or other of my "borough lists."
A real target would be to see 100 species in each of the ten boroughs. and I wondered if anyone has considered this for a bit of fun; recording common species in various different boroughs thus takes on an extra significance.
For the record, my humble "total of totals" is presently on 539 across all ten boroughs (average therefore 53.9 per borough; - it's rather convenient there are ten, isn't it?). Is there any interest in this?

Regards, Mike P.

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

Mike Passant wrote:

My "birding time" in Greater Manchester is generally precious,and I'm often just in transit through the county en route to somewhere else, so it's seemingly always against the clock, which is why when I am down here, I'm normally out and about around 4.30 a.m. to maximise both the experience, the fun, and the opportunity.
(It really strikes me that time here elapses at a faster rate than in the rest of the universe, and have been trying to decide whether this would make you residents look older, or younger, than you actually are. - I think you should look older?)

However, I'm digressing a bit.

I've started a spread with all the species I've seen in each of the ten Manchester Borough's, and it does add an extra dimension to my birding visits. Even if I fail to add a Manchester lifer on any given visit, I can generally add to one or other of my "borough lists."
A real target would be to see 100 species in each of the ten boroughs. and I wondered if anyone has considered this for a bit of fun; recording common species in various different boroughs thus takes on an extra significance.
For the record, my humble "total of totals" is presently on 539 across all ten boroughs (average therefore 53.9 per borough; - it's rather convenient there are ten, isn't it?). Is there any interest in this?

Regards, Mike P.

Hi Mike,

I am targeting 100 species in a year in Manchester Borough alone(not GM but Manchester Borough) in what is arguably the toughest Borough of all the 10.

I have already equalled last years total of 97 (albeit driving me insane at times!

)but it's a real tough one. I have only visited Heaton Park on a couple of occaions this year as well but you do have to be careful with Boundaries there so have strictly stuck to the rules.

I think 100 in my home Borough of Manchester is enough never mind the other nine boroughs!!

. I can't imagine what it would be like doing a full on GM year list.

The ton is on in Manchester Borough however, watch this space, it's all good fun!

-- Edited by Phil Owen on Tuesday 22nd of May 2012 06:34:11 PM

Ian Woosey · Status: Offline

Mike Passant wrote:
With less than 4 weeks left to year end an update on how the borough listing efforts are going would be appreciated ?

Dec 2011:

Bolton: Andy Makin - 164

Bolton: Simon Warford - 141

Bury: Simon Johnson - 139

Manchester: Phil Owen - 95

Manchester: Tony Coatsworth - 88

Oldham: Mark Rigby - 113

Rochdale: Simon Hitchen - 125

Tameside: Karen Foulkes - 124

Trafford: Henry Cook - 127

Wigan: Dave Broome - 158

Wigan: Nick Isherwood - 149

Wigan: Ian Woosey - 141

Wigan: Rob Thorpe - 131

Wigan: Jimmy Meadows - 125

Wigan: Geoff Hargreaves - 122

Wigan: Mike Passant - 106

-- Edited by Ian Woosey on Monday 5th of December 2011 11:47:29 AM

Mike Passant · Status: Offline

With less than 4 weeks left to year end an update on how the borough listing efforts are going would be appreciated?

There are certainly some terrific performances in progress; (Bolton in particular looks just staggering, and not too far short of what would constitute a great effort in Greater Manchester County terms!)

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

Here's last year for comparison - maybe I need to move to Wigan to get off the bottom !

Still Phil & I have managed a creditable 15% or so improvement on last years efforts and there's still time yet for a few more.

30/11/2010
Simon Warford Bolton 146
Rob Thorpe Wigan 146
Dave Broome Wigan 145
Simon Johnson Bury 136
Geoff Hargreaves Wigan 128
Karen Foulkes Tameside 127
Simon Hitchen Rochdale 124
Craig Higson Wigan 120
Henry Cook Trafford 119
Jimmy Meadows Wigan 119
Steve Atkins Rochdale 117
John Raynor Stockport 112
Sean Sweeney Manchester 89
Phil Owen Manchester 84
Tony Coatsworth Manchester 74

Geoff Hargreaves · Status: Offline

A noteworthy additon to the list

Mike Passant wigan 103 from just 13 visits a commendable effort from a long distance
visitor,or is birding in wigan that easy

cheers geoff

Geoff Hargreaves · Status: Offline

2011 halfway over,just a quick shuffty of who,s got to where,info gleaned from the forum

Andy Makin bolton 144
Dave Broome wigan 139
Nick Isherwood wigan 127
Simon Warford bolton ......126
Henry Cook Trafford 124
Geoff Hargeaves wigan 122
Karen Foulkes tameside 121
Simon Johnson bury 121
Simon Hitchen rochdale 120
Jimmy Meadows wigan 119
Mark Rigby oldham 108
Phil Owens m,cr 92
Tony Coatsworth m,cr 85

pm me if i,ve missed you out

,or if you want editing out

ladbrooks may have closed the book on this one

cheers geoff

errors & cock ups accepted

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

My Manchester list will never get beyond 100 as I've decided not to redraw the boundaries and include the 'spit' at Heaton Park. According to the A-Z it's in Bury and that's that

Just have to sit and wait now for the Oystercatchers to fly into Manchester airspace.

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Them's the breaks Dave! I haven't got Osprey on my Pennington Flash list yet I,ve seen one over there. Trouble is it flew over my head at Hope Carr and I watched it from a vantage point circling the flash

What you count on your own personal, private list is of course entirely down to the observer though. And quite rightly so too

dave broome · Status: Offline

to confuse things further, the Bufflehead at Astley Moss Peat Pools a few years ago was in Salford, but only visible from a vantage point in Wigan - so it's a species which no GM birder could have on their Borough list??

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

Cheers Ian, I will certainly check as clearly the same principle applies here but on a bigger scale.

Otherwise, might have to get the old tape measure out then, as don't want to be cheating!!

-- Edited by Phil Owen on Monday 28th of March 2011 09:45:41 PM

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Heaton Park Reservoir is a big place, bigger than your average county river

. I have discussed this matter with the site's regular watcher and Bury borough lister, Simon Johnson, a good while ago. Best private message him and ask what he does

. Or alternatively try Sean Sweeny who covers the same site for Manchester borough. Then it's all fair.

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

Thanks Ian,

Interestingly then, would the same apply to Heaton Park??

Like you say, no Town Hall clock at stake here but I do still want to make sure I get my own Borough list done on the correct basis nonetheless.

Heaton Park is roughly split into two as you well know, Manchester and Bury.

For the sake of Borough listing for Manchester, can a bird be counted on the Manchester Borough list as long as it is anywhere on the Reservoir then??

Cheers

Now where's that Town Hall clock???

-- Edited by Phil Owen on Monday 28th of March 2011 08:37:12 PM

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

If the river IS the border, then a bird in the river is effectively in the border or each borough. Therefore it can be counted in either. Never mind the boundary actually runs down the centre of the river etc etc, it's not the town hall clock we're playing here for is it

. Most boundaries are physically obvious using a decent map (A to Z) but like you say Phil, others are slightly more ambiguous. At the end of the day, yes there are 'guidelines' but it rests on your own integrity as to what you'll count when we get to the real intricacies of borough boundaries etc. If you can justify it to yourself and perhaps other borough listers then go forth and list...

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

How do we go on if a certain River is the actual border of the 2 boroughs???

I could do with some clarification on this one for my borough list. Cheers

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Saw the wink Riggers and fully understood it's intention

but it's a very valid question that I have previously been asked too and is bound to rear its head again!

Mark Rigby · Status: Offline

Ian/Tony
If you looked at the end of my comment you would have seen a 'wink' which should have indicated that the post was said in jest!

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

Sorry - I meant Bury - the reservoir straddles the border. Yes - if I was stood on the Bury shore and saw an Osprey in Manchester then it's a Manchester tick - surely it's where the bird is that counts, not the observer.

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Firstly, no part of Heaton Park Reservoir is in Rochdale anyway

but as a subject discussed at length, birds have to be seen within the borough they are being claimed for

. Whether you're stood in the borough at the time or not becomes down to your own personal preference I suppose. The lists are for birds seen within a borough and don't mention anything about where you're stood at the time. Of course a bird seen distantly in flight and 'presumed' to be over a particular boroughs airspace is really pushing it!

-- Edited by Ian McKerchar on Sunday 27th of March 2011 07:45:58 PM

Mark Rigby · Status: Offline

Tony Coatsworth wrote:

Just to confirm - if I'm stood looking at Heaton Park Reservoir and I see a Lapwing on the Rochdale shore - it's not countable for Manchester if I'm stood in Manchester.
--------------------------------------------
What if you were doing a Manchester list and saw a bird in Manchester but you are stood in Rochdale!

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

Just to confirm - if I'm stood looking at Heaton Park Reservoir and I see a Lapwing on the Rochdale shore - it's not countable for Manchester if I'm stood in Manchester Borough ?

Ian McKerchar wrote:
All species should be seen IN the borough they are being claimed for. Acceptable species follow the guidelines used for all list on the Manchester Birding website. I suggest anyone not fully aware of where the boundary for their borough lies should invest a few quid in the Greater Manchester birders bible. The Manchester A to Z. It not only obviously gives you all the site maps etc but the county borough boundaries are clearly marked on there too. Note, Rochdale birders can't count White Holme For the purposes of lists on the website a full list of species seen (with atleast those other than the common ones also giving the location and date) should be submitted at the end of the year so it can be published for all to see (probably, unless it involved too much typing for me). I also welcome a short monthly 'diary'(submitted after each month, no deadline though ) from any borough year listers to be included on a new page on the website. Anyone interested (and there are more than a few agreed to do one) or requiring more details of what it involves (not much!) should contact me by email. -- Edited by Ian McKerchar on Wednesday 3rd of February 2010 07:36:06 PM

Steve Almond · Status: Offline

Good to see Bolton top of the league. Well done Simon! A great last minuter, just like last night at the Reebok.

Craig Higson · Status: Offline

Just sent my list to Ian and realised that I'd miscounted and my 2010 total is 126 not 124. It matters not, but I felt the need to be accurate

Suzanne Tattersall · Status: Offline

I seemed to have provoked a mixed response on "lists". I think I possibly just wanted a borough list, just somewhere I could record what I have seen when out, nothing too fancy as an inexperienced bird watcher. I am currently using an old RSPB log book but have since found the BTO webpage useful for recording. Being inexperienced, a list does help with the looking up and identifying birds for personal use.

Phil Owen · Status: Offline

Although I haven't personally changed to a "Boundary birder" I must admit I do enjoy this Borough birding.

I also cover a local patch and keep a GM list as well as a life list involving doing some twitching, all of which I thoroughly enjoy!!

The Borough lists are, as Ian quite rightly says, a bit of fun, but one thing to bear in mind is that they are also very convenient for doing some birding during only an hour or so's spare time, locally for example, when walking the dog etc.

The self-finding is there for all birders doing the Borough listing too (I managed to find some of my own last year) and surely this has to be more beneficial as a whole to GM listings?? as more people are concentrating on a smaller area and at the same time contributing to the full GM County records and painting a better picture for the County as a whole.

Simon Warford · Status: Offline

My Bolton 2010 borough list will be with Ian in the next few days, quite pleased with 148 species.

Obvious highlights, Shorelark, Waxwing, Black Redstarts, Grey Plover(2), Osprey, Cuckoo, Pied Flycatcher, Little Egret, Twite, Lapland Bunting(4), Snow Bunting, Hen Harrier(2), Gannet, Smew & Corn Bunting.

Lets see what we can unearth in 2011...

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Ian McKerchar wrote:

We are a county first and foremost, the borough lists are a bit of fun but have already turned some birders into 'boundary birders'!

Quite the contrary for me, keeping a Wigan Borough list has encouraged me to travel further afield, albeit within Wigan, than I would normally do, as I would usually just be covering a few very local patches.

Ian McKerchar wrote:

...As for birding to a list, well if that's your bag then fair enough but it much better just to go out and see what you can find, no pre-conceived ideas and all.

Hence why I suggested the BOU List. You won't end up disappointed that you didn't "tick" everything off the list as there's no way of seeing them all in Greater Manchester, yet you can easily record what you do see as everything (except if it's a first for Britain!) is on there.

-- Edited by Rob Thorpe on Tuesday 4th of January 2011 10:25:08 PM

Joey Eccles · Status: Offline

Not quite a borough but i've created a list for Worsley that i hope to try and see over the coming year. I've just used previous site records from the past few years to compile a list. 88 is the target - although that does include LSW

and hobby - but i remain hopeful!

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Something similar to Tony's suggession is one the way but a full and definative list for each borough is certainly not on the cards. We are a county first and foremost, the borough lists are a bit of fun but have already turned some birders into 'boundary birders'!

If one needs an idea of where to go to see something then as Paul states the county bird report is the best option although the site guides on the website also provide a good option. As for birding to a list, well if that's your bag then fair enough but it much better just to go out and see what you can find, no pre-conceived ideas and all.

-- Edited by Ian McKerchar on Tuesday 4th of January 2011 09:39:41 PM

Paul Wilson · Status: Offline

I would think the nearest thing is the GM Bird Report.

Tony Coatsworth · Status: Offline

Perhaps Suzanne is after a list by borough rather than the whole of GM

I'm not sure such lists exist, but I'm sure Ian has nothing better to do

and can merge any borough lists he receives to produce a 'target' for each borough ?

Suzanne Tattersall · Status: Offline

Very funny, I'll be lucky to make 50 but I'm never disappointed with what I see

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Ian McKerchar wrote:

Just don't expect to see a few hundred of those species on that BOU list in this county though Suzanne or you'll be disappointed

Don't be such a pessimist!

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Just don't expect to see a few hundred of those species on that BOU list in this county though Suzanne or you'll be disappointed

Rob Thorpe · Status: Offline

Suzanne Tattersall wrote:

Is there a downloadable list of the birds to try and see in the county?

Hi Suzanne,

Try the BOU List here: http://www.bou.org.uk/recbrlst1.html

I find it useful to copy and paste this list in to Microsoft Excel, then keep track of your list that way. If you want to send me your email address (via a private message) I can send you one I made earlier...

Hope this helps.

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Thickos think the same too John

JOHN TYMON · Status: Offline

Ian McKerchar wrote:

Erm, no, not really.

A systematic list, which lists every species ever recorded in the county and it's status can be found on the Manchester Birding website though.

great minds think alike

Ian McKerchar · Status: Offline

Erm, no, not really.

A systematic list, which lists every species ever recorded in the county and it's status can be found on the Manchester Birding website though.

JOHN TYMON · Status: Offline

Suzanne Tattersall wrote:

Is there a downloadable list of the birds to try and see in the county?

Try the main website,as there is a comprehensive list of all the county birds there,that im sure will print off.

Suzanne Tattersall · Status: Offline

Is there a downloadable list of the birds to try and see in the county?