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Post Info TOPIC: BIRD BEHAVIOUR


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RE: BIRD BEHAVIOUR


I filmed a Heron the other day eating a Mallard duckling that must have been right on the threshold of what it could swallow. It was almost fully grown.

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Hi Rick,
Saw the same effect as you describe last June, with A Buzzard over Lostock Mire and reported this ''hovering'' twice
under the Middlebrook Valley Trail thread.
This bird was not riding the wind and looked, as you say just like a Kestrel's hover.

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Hi Rick, I witnessed the same thing a week or so back near Orrell but thought nothing of it as I'm relatively new to birding. It was definitely a buzzard I saw too as I was watching on the fence before it flew off for it's kill. Would be interesting to know if this isn't common behaviour!


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I saw a Buzzard hovering like a Kestrel in Scotland at the weekend. I've never seen this before. It wasn't using the wind, it was properly hovering in exactly the same way as a Kestrel with slightly slower wing beats. It even did the steadying wing shivers of a Kestrel. It was definitely 100% a Buzzard.

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Had a male Wheatear singing to his mate today from about 18 inches away on top of a wall. ..... nothing spectacular but very low and intense.

As you say Tim ... oblivious to me about 12 ft away.

Think I've only ever heard them making the clicking sound before.

So one of those special moments that I'll probably never witness again.

Roger.

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Tim glad to hear that someone else feels the same wonder at these great little moments in the natural world, they really don't leave you. its only a few years or so since i watched the dancing display of the male whitethroat but it will live long in the memory.

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dave broome wrote:

Tim Wilcox wrote:

Witnessing a courtship dance from even our most common species is a moment of delight and wonder and isn't that often experienced. A Chaffinch courtship dance I witnessed at Millgate Fields, Didsbury over 10 years ago ranks in my top 10 birding experiences - seriously! Never seen it since. The male sang within 6 inches of the female perched on separate twigs and at the same time shuffled sideways to and fro. I watched from about 6 feet. They were oblivious to my presence like your Chiffchaffs



Tim, a pair of Chaffinch were displaying like this on the ground at Binn Green recently, close to myself, John Rayner and Mark Rigby. It isn't something which I could recall seeing previously. Great stuff



These are true birding moments really. Running about ticking stuff off is fun but in a way not real birding

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On Sunday I noticed Coal Tits beside the lower path up to Binn Green doing a wing-shivering routine with an almost insect-like call. Reminded me of something similar done by a Chiffchaff at Strinesdale the other Spring, and the food solicitation done by a female Robin just before mating.

-- Edited by Mike Chorley on Monday 14th of April 2014 09:47:04 PM

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Tim Wilcox wrote:

Witnessing a courtship dance from even our most common species is a moment of delight and wonder and isn't that often experienced. A Chaffinch courtship dance I witnessed at Millgate Fields, Didsbury over 10 years ago ranks in my top 10 birding experiences - seriously! Never seen it since. The male sang within 6 inches of the female perched on separate twigs and at the same time shuffled sideways to and fro. I watched from about 6 feet. They were oblivious to my presence like your Chiffchaffs



Tim, a pair of Chaffinch were displaying like this on the ground at Binn Green recently, close to myself, John Rayner and Mark Rigby. It isn't something which I could recall seeing previously. Great stuff

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Dave Tennant wrote:

Just watched a pair of chiffchaff at close quarters down to about 5 metres in a hawthorn tree, they were totally unaware that i was watching [ it seemed like that anyway ]. the male was fluffing out his feathers and looked bigger and every few seconds would call out the familiar chiffchaff call, what i presume was the female would in response give out a simple high pitched cheap, this went on for several minutes with the male following the female round the tree.





Witnessing a courtship dance from even our most common species is a moment of delight and wonder and isn't that often experienced. A Chaffinch courtship dance I witnessed at Millgate Fields, Didsbury over 10 years ago ranks in my top 10 birding experiences - seriously! Never seen it since. The male sang within 6 inches of the female perched on separate twigs and at the same time shuffled sideways to and fro. I watched from about 6 feet. They were oblivious to my presence like your Chiffchaffs

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Just watched a pair of chiffchaff at close quarters down to about 5 metres in a hawthorn tree, they were totally unaware that i was watching [ it seemed like that anyway ]. the male was fluffing out his feathers and looked bigger and every few seconds would call out the familiar chiffchaff call, what i presume was the female would in response give out a simple high pitched cheap, this went on for several minutes with the male following the female round the tree.

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I've never seen exactly what you witnessed Tim, but the males can be particularly aggressive in the breeding season - and not just towards other male grouse. I remember stories from a few years back of one individual which would attack human passers-by - but only ones wearing red clothing smile

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Steve "Make your birdwatching count!"


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Seeking any info on what turned out to be (to me anyway) a most extraordinary sighting at Binn Green this evening whilst failing to see any species of Crossbill. Two Red Grouse flew up the valley towards me calling with one bird attacking the other and pecking it repeatedly. They flew up to a height of over 80ft and carried on up the hill. Has anyone seen such behaviour in Red Grouse before?

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Near Roman Lakes a juvenile Green Woodpecker was excavating an ant mound and tucking in. It was temporarily displaced by a Magpie that dropped in to sample an easy food source. It ate a few but apparently not to its liking and the Green Woodpecker resumed when it flew off.

Cheers John

-- Edited by John Rayner on Sunday 11th of August 2013 02:42:26 PM

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For the last few days we've had a young robin in the garden. Today it was perched on the bird table watching a female blackbird bathing in the birdbath. A couple of times the robin tried to fly in whilst the blackbird was still in with no success. When the blackbird had finished the robin immediately flew in and started to bath itself.

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Gary Mills


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On 19th July, on the Stamford Park, Ashton-under-Lyne thread Steve Suttill reported a female Mallard which appeared to have "adopted" three small Tufted Duck ducklings. When I visited the same site on 22nd July a female Mallard looked to be escorting 2 Mallard & 2 Tufted Duck ducklings. Visits to Alexandra Park, Oldham on 21st July found a "traditional" Tufted Duck family of a female with 6 ducklings but also 3 female Mallards seemingly in charge of mixed broods of Mallard/Tufted Duck ducklings in the following numbers - 7/5, 5/4 & 3/1. Two further visits to this site in the following week were perhaps a little more confusing as the young ducklings grew and became more mobile but still the general impression gained was that many of the Tufted Duck ducklings did not appear to be under the guidance and supervision of female Tufted Ducks.

Two possible explanations have been forward for these observations but rather than outline them and pre-empt others opinions on such a subject I am asking if anyone else has records in recent times in GM of mixed broods of specifically Mallard and Tufted Duck ducklings and their thoughts/opinions on how these might have arisen. I have had a look through the last 10 years county bird reports and I can't find any such similar sightings being reported.

Many thanks,

Bill.


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Each morning the milkman places 3 x 4 pint plastic cartons of milk through the railings in the gate at my workplace in Salford. Occasionally one of the cartons develops a hole in it and we end up with a large puddle of milk, this is always blamed on the milkman's heavy handedness.

Early this morning as I arrived at work I noticed two of the local Carrion Crows in my works yard and they were taking it in turn to peck at one of the cartons eventually causing the milk to leak out. As a large puddle began to form both birds started to bathe and generally splash about. A third Crow flew down and a good time was had by all.

I let them have five minutes before I went to get the remaining cartons. I remember as a kid seeing Blue tits pecking at the silver milk bottle tops at my parents home but if these Crows start doing this regularly the poor milkman is going to get fed up with my manager moaning at him

<img src="www.sparkimg.com/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" alt="biggrin" title="biggrin" />

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Dave Thacker


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Cheers John, it was something I couldn't remember seeing

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See it regularly at houghton green pool,saw 2 pairs displaying the other day and a few pairs at penny,doas seem strange in winter plumage,but its not uncommon.I think its a bonding display when they have returned after say the water was too flooded and they moved away from thier normal water,when they return they display :)

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A work colleague saw two Great Crested Grebe displaying on Amberswood Lake, Hindley yesterday (19th Oct) and showed me a photo he had taken, as he was surprised to see it at this time of year. I couldn't recall seeing this in autumn either. Anybody seen this?

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Your right. It does not look as dark as the owl footage. I think he needs a timestamp on the videos for night filming. I have asked Alun does he know the actual time and i will post when i get a reply. great footage. cheers Den

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Looking at the video I'm not sure it's actually that dark and like Paul think it may actually have been taken at dusk when they often hunt. The lighting on the video looks a little too 'bright' (you can clearly see detail in the background), especially compared to the Tawny Owl video which was obviously taken in total darkness and only the area immediately around the feeding stump (and bird itself) is lit.

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Ian McKerchar (forum administrator and owner)


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Yeah very interesting about the bat hawking, the birds going into roosting starlings at night, Alan did not know what time the footage was took, he is experimenting with nightvision and motion sensors to trigger any movement to see what he can get, he has had barn owls as expected on the post at night but he did not expect a sparrowhawk,

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Nice bit of footage Dennis, do you know what time it was taken? they regulary hunt birds going to roost so could still be eating in darkness if it had caught one last thing. saying that though American Falconers have used Coopers Hawks ( larger than Sparrowhawk but not as big as a Goshawk) to hunt Starlings at night, in total darkness with some success. see the following link and scroll down to Bat Hawking www.americanfalconry.com/recipe.html
regards Paul

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midnight feast


yeah i already mentioned about Peregrines hunting Woodcocks at dusk, i understand what is mentioned about bats but i would say in this video the bird is definatley plucking feathers, you see some of them float away, looks like a bird to me? i was thinking about the bird disturbing known roost sites for a midnight feast, easy picking, we all know Sparrowhawks regualary visit known gardens with feeders including mine to hunt for food, maybe they go to known roosting sites at night to also hunt for food, still lots we dont know about birds, ?

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RE: BIRD BEHAVIOUR


Yes I saw that nick.think it cited the extra light in the city making it possible for them to hunt.its a good shout.maybe there are plenty of street lights near the camera site.would love to know what it caught.was it taken from roost etc.

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Wasn't there an item on Springwatch this year about city centre Peregrines that had been discovered to be taking prey at night?

I think they'd found the remains of Woodcock, etc around their nest site which only migrate at night.

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That is interesting Dennis.a call to dave cully might be in order!I suppose if anyone would have observed this before it would be him.I wonder if it was a bat that was caught?would be good to know more about this subject...

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Sparrowhawk hunting at night?



An interesting video on flickr. A friend of mine set up nightvision filming to capture owls and instead caught a Sparrowhawk with a fresh kill at nightime, i did not know sparrowhawks hunted at night? interesting





http://www.flickr.com/photos/46443141@N07/7969160196/in/contacts/

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RE: BIRD BEHAVIOUR


Going back many years I saw a gull on the receiving end for a change. At Elton Reservoir I watched a couple of Crows attack a gull after it had caught a fish. They made it drop the fish and one of the Crows scooped it up from the water and carried it away to a nest.




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Hi bill thanks for the response.
Yes I am aware of kleptoparasitism and that is certainly what it appeared to be I have just never seen the tactic employed on a house martin!it was comfortably outflying the gull and didn't appear injured in any way.it could have mistaken it for a petrel though I am not sure it would have even seen one yet!
Regarding the great crested grebe I once saw a black headed gull swimming behind an adult and getting fed.whether this was maternal instinct or a case of just feeding it to get rid is anyone's guess.
Whatever it was it tickled my fancy anyway.its always nice to see something new and I wondered if anyone had seen this behaviour before.
Cheers Chris.

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chrisdorney wrote:

I was at the Albert docks today and saw a juv herring gull chasing a house martin.I am presuming it was after a mouthful of insects but I have never seen this before.any other ideas?
Cheers Chris.





Hi Chris,

You are probably right in your observation, gulls are well-known for their habit of stealing food from other birds - kleptoparasitism is I think the technical term given to the practice by academics and other such users of long words! It was interesting to read Chris Brown's post on the Jumbles CP thread yesterday of Black-headed Gulls harassing a Great Crested Grebe juvenile, probably to try and pinch food. Interestingly, I also watched yesterday a juvenile Great Crested Grebe at Blackleach CP in Walkden, which was audibly begging for food but being ignored by a fairly distant adult. The whining juvenile was being trailed closely and doggedly by a Black-headed Gull too. One worries for the chances of this young bird which is presumably in the early days of making its own way in the world. Will it get enough food that it can hold on to, to be able to survive until it is a little more worldly and able to escape the attentions of its unwanted stalker!

Another explanation might be that the gull was actually after the bird itself? Many bird species higher up the food chain appear to have an awareness of weak, injured or naive birds and may look to take advantage of that as a source of food? I'm not knowledgeable enough to know if a juvenile Herring Gull would yet have such awareness or skill to catch and then kill another bird and if the House Martin was able to escape the attentions of the gull anyway this probably seems a less likely explanation then.

I'm not sure I've answered your question but your interesting observation shows us all how little we still understand about many fascinating aspects of bird behaviour.

Regards,

Bill.


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I was at the Albert docks today and saw a juv herring gull chasing a house martin.I am presuming it was after a mouthful of insects but I have never seen this before.any other ideas?
Cheers Chris.

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I watched the Common Terns on Horrocks last weekend passing fish between themselves and flying around with food,I,m only guessing but I think it,s a natural urge to catch more than they need and they would normally still have young to pander to,so a bad breeding year might explain this behaviour.

cheers geoff

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I had the same with two Common Terns at Pennington flash a few weeks ago. There's a couple of photos of it on my Flickr page.
I noted at the time that they were both adult birds and did find it a little strange.

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Today at Pearsons Flash I was counting through the ducks and noticed one of the juv Great Crested Grebes pick some weed up. It then proceeded to do part of a courtship display with an adult bird, which had almost moulted into winter plumage (this may be coincidental). I wondered whether anyone else has observed juvenile GC Grebes practice courtship displays at this time of year

Also something else I have never seen at this time of the year, both Common Terns I saw were adult birds and one of them caught a fish and gave it to the other (presumably a female), perhaps this is just pair bonding

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Over Brown Low (Ludworth) a Peregrine repeatedly swooped (not stooped) at a Kestrel. When it tired of this it swooped over the treetops whilst hanging its legs and deliberately brushed the top foliage with its talons. This was repeated about 6x. Could it be a tactic to drive out prey?

Cheers, John

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For the last two weeks a Magpie has been taking advantage of my pond fish. Sometimes after I have fed my Koi and Goldfish with a floating food pellet, the Magpie swoops down and eats any pellets that have failed to drop into the pond. The bird has also realised that if it is quick enough it can walk on the Water lily leaves while quickly flapping its wings and get to the pellets before they go soft or the fish eat them. Unfortunately for the Magpie I am not the only one to have noticed his pond dipping as when the Magpie came down to feed this evening after I put out some pellets for the fish a neighbours cat which was hiding behind my large Sedge plant made a grab for the bird. Both ended up in the pond which was lucky for the Magpie as the cat had to let go of it. Exit one very wet cat and after drying off and checking over the Magpie it managed to fly off. I bet it gives the pond a miss tomorrow

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Steve Suttill wrote:

There's a big debate about open access to academic research going on at the moment - I await the result with interest.

Steve





Wonder how much they'll charge for the results then?

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Sadly, it's not the academics that get the money - it's the publishers (and probably their bankers ).

There's a big debate about open access to academic research going on at the moment - I await the result with interest.

Steve

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Hi Steve,

Many thanks for that. I wasn't aware of those two options you mention. As you say, there appears to be some potentially interesting papers on the subject but most do seem to come at a cost. I don't know what it is with these academics? - they're just not satisfied enough with being blessed with high IQs but they also want wealth as well! ...........whilst I have to try and get along with neither!

Cheers,

Bill.


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Fascinating stuff, Bill, with lots of food for thought

You mentioned looking at the BTO Birdfacts pages and right at the bottom of those pages are links to scientific papers via Google Scholar and Scirus. I had a quick look there but the papers which seem to have the most specific research on creches (I can't type accents ) are ones which you have to pay to view/download

Worth rooting around though - I've found loads of interesting FREE papers via this route whilst researching other species.

Steve

-- Edited by Steve Suttill on Tuesday 3rd of July 2012 05:29:50 PM

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Have recently returned from a weeks holiday in North Wales - I stayed in Glan Conwy in a flat directly overlooking the River Conwy estuary - so had fantastic views of all the birds on and around the inter-tidal area. One species I haven't observed at close quarters during the breeding season is Shelduck and it was really fascinating to watch a good number of family parties and crèches and enjoy and marvel at their behaviour. Since my return I have tried to look through books and the internet to see how these crèches are formed but come up with conflicting information and nothing really definitive. Are these crèches formed passively by adults willingly handing over the care of their young to other adults? Is it therefore a case of "Would you be kind enough to just look after our little Shelley and Sheldon for a few months whilst we jet off for a few months for our annual moult holiday on the Wadden Sea"? Or do the parents just clear off and leave the young ducklings "home alone" and then these get "mopped up" by other willing foster parents? Or are the crèches formed aggressively? The reason I ask is that I observed one pair with 9 very small ducklings in not particularly close proximity to another pair with a single approx. 2/3rds sized duckling. The male from the larger family made a longish walk but in a deliberate beeline for the other male, with an aggressive neck extended, head down, hunched shoulder posture and tried to chase it away and despite managing to pull out a few tail feathers failed. In the same brief whirr of activity it then appeared to target the single juvenile and my impression gained was of an attempt to try and dislodge it from its parents but this too failed. I wondered if there might be some benefit to this pair to try and "capture" an older duckling? If anyone has any knowledge or pointers on where to look for further info on this subject I'd be interested to hear. Maybe there isn't one simple answer and all three methods are involved in crèche formation?

Another thing that crossed my mind is I wonder what factors are involved in which of the breeding adults stay and look after the crèches and which decide to leave on their moult migration? Presumably the successful adults that do remain behind still undergo moult - so why don't all breeding adults remain? Particularly so, given that I have just read that the survival rates for young is apparently lower in crèches than it is in family groups? It seems possibly a bit odd to me to invest so much time and effort into bringing young into the world to then have a strategy that then might appear to lessen their chances of making it to fledging. Or maybe I'm just missing something blindingly obvious!! Had a quick look at the excellent BTO Birdfacts website at http://www.bto.org/about-birds/birdfacts/find-species This suggests that for juvenile Shelduck survival rates sees approximately 17 out of every 100 birds making it to age 2. For another sea duck that crèches its young such as Eider - 33 out of every 100 survive the first year of life but for Tufted Duck and Mallard the figures for a similar period are 63 and 52 respectively.

Just a few other incidental bits whilst waffling on - it was nice to see for once a male duck taking some interest in rearing young, although from my limited observations much the strongest bond appeared to be between the female and their young. The young were almost always closest to the female, whilst she regularly barked out instructions and the young called back. When they came in to rest at high water time and the adults settled on the shoreline the 9 young firstly all tried to get underneath her for warmth and safety, the few that couldn't make it, as it was too overcrowded, then squeezed underneath the male. The male and very occasionally both adults were incredibly aggressive - sometimes both attacking potential threats and perhaps unwisely leaving any young unattended for a short while. I actually watched one male Shelduck attack a nearby Cormorant who was a bit sluggish in getting away and it actually managed to bring it down in the water!

Cheers,


Bill.



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The main highlight of a family day out to Bakewell on Tuesday, was watching a male Blackbird stealing cherries from a greengrocer's outside display.
We were stood near the shop, ( about 4 feet away) , when the offending bird flew down,landed on a pineapple ,totally oblivious to our presence , plucked a nice juicy cherry from the bunch,and preceded to fly off over the river to the trees on the large island !
We watched the Blackbird repeat this behaviour several times , over the next 20 minutes or so, despite it flying precariously close to a few passing vehicles ! ( feeding a late brood perhaps ? )
The only other avian interest , was provided by a female Tufted Duck, desperately trying to prevent her single tiny ducking , from being swept over the weir....

Cheers Chris

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At the water's edge on Sale WP today, I watched a Crow juggle with, and then swallow head first, a small fish. I presume the fish was already deceased, and washed up on the shore, rather than the Crow developing Kingfisher- type
fishing techniques.

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On Ludworth Moor 2 Little Owls perched in drizzle on a drystone wall. As the rain began in earnest they didn't seek nearby shelter but spread their wings wide with a belly down/head up posture and fluffed up their feathers. Some sort of feather cleaning technique perhaps.

Cheers, John

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Dave Thacker wrote:

A Magpie was catching and eating young froglets which were hiding in the grass next to my garden pond this evening.





The Magpies were eating tadpoles from our pond a few weeks back and often help themselves to frogs too.

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A Magpie was catching and eating young froglets which were hiding in the grass next to my garden pond this evening.

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Dave Thacker


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I have on several occasions observed young magpies chase each other up and down the branches of a tree in what can described as a playful manner.

Mike

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Do bird,s have fun?? promted by my better half a confirmed non birder (thank goodness) yours to discuss,I can only think of the crows in Dumbo and the vultures in Bedknobs and Broomsticks

cheers geoff

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